Emmy, known as Emmymade, chats with Brittany about food, work-life balance, and staying inspired. Then, Brittany chats with Jamie Reichstein, YouTube’s head of Creator Partnerships, about how the platform supports creators.
Over a decade ago, Emmy was living in Japan, feeling alone, and looking for a way to connect with others, so she turned to YouTube. In this week’s episode, Emmy talks to Brittany about her love of food and experimenting, and how YouTube has given her the flexibility to create her ideal life. Then, to learn more about how YouTube helps support creators, Brittany chats with Jamie Reichstein, YouTube’s head of Creator Partnerships. Some participants have been compensated for their involvement in this series.
KEY TOPICS & TIME STAMPS
RESOURCES
SOCIAL HANDLES
CREDITS
The Upload is a podcast by YouTube produced in partnership with National Public Media. Our Executive Producers are Brianna LaFleur and Erica Osher. Supervising Producer Shannon Boerner. Our Lead Producer is Theresa Avila; Editing and Engineering by Alie Kilts; Production Assistance by Gurjit Kaur with support from Maddy Weinberg. Our logo was created by Jen Grottle and our music is by TimaLikesMusic. Hosted by Brittany Luse.
Featuring: Emmy Cho of Emmymade
[0:00]
Brittany: I'm going to be honest with you for a minute. I have a cookbook addiction.
[music in]
It doesn't matter if they're on the bestsellers list or in the discount bin, it's gotten so bad that my fiancé actually put me on a cookbook buying moratorium.
Cookbooks are great. Nobody believes this more than I do, but I just have one bone to pick with them. They don't have enough photos. Sometimes they don't even have a photo of the finished product. Look, if I'm being really honest, I've learned the most about how to make food from watching cooking videos. Cookbooks will show it the most beautiful finished dish, but the videos show the process.
[SFX - Boiling water]
Like how fast is a rolling boil? And when you saute an onion...
[SFX - Sizzle]
...what does translucent actually look like? And how brown is browned meat.
[1:00]
Anyway, I'm telling you all of this, because if I'm trying out a new recipe, I'm going to the internet for help.
[bell]
Which really just means I'm looking on youtube. Because let's be real. There is a ton of food content on YouTube. There's family-friendly recipes, cake, and pastry delights, mukbang videos, and so much more. But even in that sea of content, it's still possible to carve out a niche that’s all your own. That’s exactly what today’s guest did.
[theme music]
I’m your host, Brittany Luse. And this is The Upload: The Rise of the Creator Economy, a special podcast from YouTube in partnership with National Public Media. In this episode, we're going to chat with Emmy Cho, the woman behind the uber-popular food channel, Emmymade. Emmy is a creator with almost 3 million subscribers and fans from around the globe.
[music out]
[2:00]
For more than a decade, Emmy has been documenting all sorts of food experiments and curious taste tests.
[music in]
Her videos range from...cooking a ribeye steak in a jar...to making a cake that looks like a raindrop! You never know what to expect!
[EMMY ARCHIVAL]
“Today, I’m going to be making an interesting version of grilled cheese with Mountain Dew.”
“Oh my gosh, my ribeye steak cooked in a jar. It’s like the original slow cooker.”
“Using extra sharp cheese, I think was a good call.”
"Wow! That’s...pretty green.”
Brittany: Emmy’s channel began as a simple way for her to connect with others while she was living abroad. In the years since, she’s moved back to the States and has grown her brand to such a degree, that it's turned into a family business. Emmy’s millions of viewers have provided her with MORE than just the ability to support her family financially. They’ve granted her the freedom and flexibility to show up as the parent and partner she wants to be.
[3:00]
Here's my conversation with Emmymade.
Brittany: Hi, Emmy. It's so nice to meet you.
Emmy: Hi, Brittany is lovely to meet you as well.
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Brittany: Let me actually, I realized what I need to do, is I need to make you big. There we go. So then it doesn't just feel like I'm talking to myself, like an empty, like an empty screen.
Emmy: I do that a lot, so I won't fault you for talking to yourself.
Brittany: So, um, so to get started, um, tell us who you are, um, and tell us about your channel and what you do.
Emmy: Okay. My name is Emmy and I have a YouTube channel, it's called Emmymade, which I started many years ago on a whim. And to be honest, I think it was kind of a lot of chutzpah. Cause I'm like I didn't have any experience at all editing video, nothing. And I said, well, you know, although YouTube was a really different place when I started.
[4:00]
So I was living abroad and I said, well, I'll just film my tasting and eating experiences while I'm living here. And, um, and then it's just continued for about 10 years now. And it's just been a wonderful, wonderful journey.
Brittany: You know, today I think a lot of people — myself included — look up recipes on YouTube. I mean, there’s so much content to choose from! But you started your channel in 2010, way before any of that came to be! For those who aren’t familiar with Emmymade, could you break down the kind of food content that you create? Like what makes your channel different from others?
Emmy: Sure. I'm really driven by my curiosity. I love looking, learning about things in general, besides food. I just am really thirsty for learning about things, and food just happens to be the lens I share on YouTube. So I'll research historic recipes and try those, recipes from the civil war, recipes from hard times.
[5:00]
I was really interested in what did people do in those times, when circumstances, when they didn't have the means to make whatever they wanted to make. They came up with really resourceful recipes that I just find so inspiring. And then I'll test out recipes or things that sound interesting or different, or just new to me. So it might be eating insects or it might be trying some kind of old technique just because I want to know what it's like. What is that texture? What is that smell? Or what is that combination?
Brittany: I saw you had some video where you were making something. It was like a washing machine. Like, it was like, you put the candy in there and added like some water and then you like, basically manually use the washing machine until it turned, it looked like sudsy water, but it was candy.
Emmy: Right, so in Japan, they have a candy aisle, but all these beautiful candies, but candy kits, like where you can make and mix and concoct and make these miniature candies.
[6:00]
Brittany: So before you started your channel, you had two degrees and you decided to work abroad in Japan with your now husband. Why did you end up deciding to launch your channel in Japan? And talk to me about how it's grown since then?
Emmy: I decided to start it just because, uh, I was lonely. I was really missing speaking the language with native speakers and although it was just talking to myself on camera, uh, I just really missed the perspective of being American in another country. So I thought, why not share this experience?
At the time, YouTube didn't really have a lot of that. And I said, well, let's just see what happens. And, uh, I was just able to keep it going, uh, after I moved back to the states and after I had my children. And I didn't have any intentions of doing that, it just really, I think kismet really helped me out there and I was able to just keep it going and it has grown every year. Every year, it’s grown a little bit more, and it's just been such a wonderful gift.
[7:00]
Brittany: That's amazing. Where does your love of food come from? Cause when you say like every video's about food, I mean, it's like, I mean dozens and dozens and dozens of videos, like are about food. And you're trying food, you're testing recipes, you're cooking things, you're giving people tips about how to improve their recipes. Like you are obsessed with food. Where did that love of food come from?
Emmy: I think it's really in my, in my DNA. My mother always got my brother and I in the kitchen from a very young age. We were right up there helping her peel carrots and potatoes, and she was giving us jobs. We would spend our Saturday mornings watching PBS and watching greats like Jacques Pépin and Julia. And this was before, uh, food network and all that. We could only watch it on Saturdays. We could only marathon, you know, our cooking on Saturdays. So that's really where I learned a lot of techniques. I don't have any background in cooking per say.
Brittany: It’s so interesting because your channel’s obviously very creative. Like you’re following your curiosity and trying different types of foods and recipes. I also love how you try to figure out what the result of a certain cooking technique will be. Like t’s almost like watching a scientific experiment.
[8:00]
Emmy: Oh, I love it. I love like breaking things down, and really trying to understand on a very kind of superficial level, because when you start diving deep, I'm like, okay. Um, but I really love just — like, I love it when an expert tells me in layman's terms, how something works. I just love that. Like, oh my gosh, that's amazing!
Just to have that kind of, kind of trivial pursuit knowledge. I just really, really love that. So whenever I try out a recipe, I will do the Wikipedia search and I'll do some research because I just find it so interesting. There's just so much out there that I've never even heard of and learned about.
And food just happens to be the way that I get there. And I feel like so much can be learned. You know, you may not have language. You may not have, you may not be able to travel there, but through the lens of food, we can all kind of understand each other because we all need to eat. Like we've all put food in our mouth, you know?
[9:00]
Brittany: So, you know, this is like your full-time thing.
Emmy: Yeah.
Brittany: And, just to be clear, eventually, your channel grew so much that it suddenly wasn’t just your full-time gig. It was like a family affair! One of our producers told me that your husband was able to quit his job to work with you on the business. Do you remember when you realized you could do this for a living and support your entire family?
Emmy: I think, you know, after I had my son, we moved back to the states. I was still doing it, and my husband was working. When my husband came on board full-time working with me, I think this was, that was the moment where I said, okay, all right, we're taking the leap. We're really going to see if this is going to work for us.
Brittany: Yeah.
Emmy: Luckily it did it, it really, yeah. But at the time, it was “aahh” but it, it happened.
Brittany: When did you begin to monetize your content?
[10:00]
Emmy: So I started probably within the first year, uh, in terms of monetization when I was living in Japan. And, uh, yes, but my, my audience was quite small and it just grew steadily. But, again it was different at different times. If you had a couple thousand, you'd be really, really excited and a million was a big number. These days, you know, people have tens of millions, so it's
Brittany: It's so wild.
Emmy: I know, it’s so crazy. So yeah, I remember being stoked, just like getting a comment.
I'm like, “Oh, they're talking to me. Oh my gosh!” So I replied back, and now I still read my comments. Uh, but I can't, I can't reply to all of them, but it's great to still have that exchange.
Brittany: So like, you know, this is so your business, that you recently formed an LLC, like, did that, was that like a moment for you?
Emmy: It was! You know, my husband and I kind of looked at each other and we're like, oh, we're a small business. But I mean, not that much really changed.
[11:00]
It was on advice of , you know, some people that are like, you know, this is time. I think, okay, we probably should have done it a couple years ago, but there's no real handbook. Maybe there is a handbook by this point, but I haven't read it in terms of what you're supposed to do for this.
Brittany: So what do you love most about having a food channel on YouTube? You know, that, that other traditional careers maybe wouldn't allow you to do.
Emmy: The flexibility. I think the most thing that I'm grateful for is the flexibility to raise my children the way I've always wanted to. And it was to be, for me, to really be there with my kids. I've, I've dreamed about having children for a long time, and put it off for quite a while because I wasn't in the right place for it, or the right situation.
And finally, when, uh, we were ready, it was such a great way to just be present for them in a way that I really wanted to be. And, uh, so, so grateful for that. And I could always rearrange my YouTube publishing schedule or my editing schedule to work around my children's schedule.
[12:00]
Which was wonderful, but edit, I still edit at night and film during the day. Not at naptime anymore, which is great. But before it would be during naptime, I'd be just frantic, trying to film something while they were sleeping or trying to get them to sleep. And, uh, it was pretty nuts as any parent can tell you Uh, so just having that flexibility is just so wonderful.
Brittany: Wait, so you I'm trying to get the timeline. So you had the channel before you had your first kid. What was it like to continue making videos while also, like, becoming a parent, and going on this other adventure with your family at the same time?
Emmy: It was nuts. I think initially my first, my first kid was a challenging kid. Let's put it that way, I think. But I was too. My mom, very gleefully, when she spoke with me over the phone after my son was born, said, “You know, is is he fussy?” You know, I could hear her smiling. I'm like, “Yes, mom he is.” And she's like, “Oh, interesting how genetics work.”
[13:00]
So I'm like, thanks mom. But, uh, so that was, it was tough cause I, I had to hold my kid constantly. He didn't want to be put down, and I was like, I still need to make videos. And, but you know, you manage, that's what, I think that's what you do. You figure out your child as best you can. And you, you work around that. So I have videos where I had to crop myself because I'm nursing my kid and like, you know. So you just find ways to make it work just like anybody else. The flexibility was just so, so important for our lives because you have to be flexible when you have children. Because they demand it.
Brittany: Yeah. How has that flexibility, like, changed over time? Because you've, I mean, you've had your channel for over a decade now, or just about a decade now. Does it look, uh, the same way that you initially, you know, imagine that it would?
[14:00]
Emmy: No. Yes and no. It's changed as my life has changed, and my children have changed. Now, they are in school. And so, although this past year was a whole nother set of challenges for everybody right, uh, that really freed me up some time to, when they were attending school, to have a set amount of time to film. And, and, and that I hopefully shows in, in my production quality and the amount of attention that I can actually put in the videos. Before it was just like, open up the laptop, get in front, and just like film something crazy.
And then, that was that. So, uh, even now I love to keep things simple. I’m not, I don't like to complicate things unnecessarily. So, really simple setup. I used to shoot right imy kitchen until recently. I have a separate space now. Uh, so it was always just this kind of like, it was more frantic, I think before. Now, I feel like it's a little bit more leveled and controlled because my kids have gotten older, and they have become more independent which is just wonderful.
[15:00]
Brittany: I think there's a lot of people out there who are feeling exactly that same way.
Emmy: Right? It gets better!
Brittany: You know, I think a lot of people still think all YouTube Channels are 13 year olds doing tech reviews, but so many creators are parents like you. Like you’ve gone from creating videos with like you newborns to small children. Do you have any advice for parents with small children looking to start a channel?
Emmy: I would say set up boundaries from the very, very beginning. Parents and people that are not parents as well. Uh, think about you potentially becoming a public person, a very public persona, and think about what, what boundaries and would you need. I think that's super important because as the time goes, and you're trying to make content, it's just like, oh, I'll, I'll do this or I'll do that. And then, you know, but if you've already thought about it, it's like, I won't do that. Then it's easier because then you don't have to make that kind of decision later.
[16:00]
As you continue doing this, potentially, a burnout is a very real thing and creating content is a very real thing. And, uh, you don't want to feel like you have to dig in places where you might not want to dig. So, if you set up those boundaries early on, then you don't even have to think about that.
That's one thing I've been really trying to practice of the last couple of years, is just,like, saying you have a day off, take the day off. You know, don't look at your social media for the day. Don't feel like you have to post for this day because some things are mine and they should be mine. And I think that's true for everyone.
Brittany: That’s so amazing. I wonder, what, what were you envisioning you would be doing before the channel? Like what was your, what was your plan? What were you gonna do?
Emmy: I don't know initially, like, you know, when you're a kid, you're just like, “Oh, I'm going to be a doctor. I have good intents. And I sort of pursued that path in undergraduate, and then I pursued, uh, an art degree as well.
[17:00]
And then I studied more art after. And I thought, perhaps that's where I would end up, teaching, art perhaps, or teaching something. I've always loved teaching and learning, and so I figured that might be someplace I would end up. In the beginning, it feels like, oh, yes, it's just going to be this path to become this title. And then as you start living it, it gets a little murkier.
Brittany: How do you, how do you stay inspired to come up with new content after almost 11 years of being on the platform?
Emmy: That's a great question. I have an amazing audience that always is letting me know that they've seen something that they think that I might be interested in. So it's, it's wonderful. That's another wonderful thing about social media, is that I get to hear from so many people. So like, “Emmy have you seen this? And then another person's like, “Yo Emmy.” And like, okay, okay, okay, okay. I got to try this because y'all want to see this too.
[18:00]
So it's a really great way to kind of get, uh , a pulse on what people are interested or curious about. And so, or I've never even heard of, which is wonderful because a lot of times I haven't heard of these things. So a lot of my ideas also come from just my audience, which is really fun.
Brittany: Do you feel more pressure today making your videos than you did before? Even, you know, even maybe to the point of like a larger audience, feeling more pressure with more eyes on you? Like how do you deal with that? If you feel it.
Emmy: I certainly felt pressure. I think when my, my husband took the leap with me, I'm like, okay, we're all in. I felt pressure. to keep the thing alive,
Brittany: Yeah. Yeah.
Emmy: But I think at the end, I really, I trust myself, I trust myself and what it is that I do, and who I am. And I think that's a big, big part of it. I started this, uh, pretty later in life as opposed to a lot of other content creators.
[19:00]
And so I did live some life. So I felt like I had a decent understanding of who I am and was too. And what I wanted to put out there. So with that trust, it's really been good for me, to kind of stay on the path of being true to, I guess, what you call now, they would call it your brand. And think about who you are and what works for you, what you want to put out there. Because you are the expert ultimately of yourself. You know, people will tell you, this is your best practices, yhis is what you should do, this is how you should make it.
But that's very generalized, you know? So think about what scheduling works for you. What content works for you or what stuff? I hate that content word, it gets overused I feel, Um, what subject? What, what tickles you? And will it sustain you? So those things are things. And then ultimately you're the one that's going to give you the right answer if you're true to yourself.
Brittany: Yeah. What motivates you? I want to know, like what motivates you to keep, to keep making these videos?
[20:00]
Emmy: I think it's just, again, curiosity. Like I think, even if the videos, if the YouTube were to end today, I would still be making stuff. I would still be experimenting. I, I love to think about this kind of thought experiment. When I see someone, I feel like, “Oh my gosh, that's some big wig or whatever.” I always love to think of them as like an eight year old child, because I feel like that's who we are. Like fundamentally, through the rest of our lives, whatever you were doing at eight years old, is a huge part of just who you are.
And I was, you know, mixing power and all kinds of, like, concocting all kinds of things in the kitchen, and making messes just to see what would happen. So that's still with me and I would still be making that kind of stuff. So, I would be making, experimenting, maybe making art, definitely cooking, trying out recipes regardless of, of, YouTube or social media because that's what I love to do. Would I be talking to everyone about it? Maybe not so much.
[21:00]
Brittany: This is like the core of Emmy is basically on your YouTube channel.
Brittany: It's like, you really got to go back to like, you know, like you're saying we're all sort of eight year olds on the inside.
Emmy: Yeah.
Brittany: So you got to go back, and like fulfill that eight-year-old Emmy wish.
[music in]
Emmy: Totally. All the time. I do a lot of projects with my kids, and it's related to things that I always, I'm like, ugh, I just didn't have the right ingredients to make a, whatever it is, to make a certain kind of slime or so I'd substitute something and it would fail.
So I would tell my kids, you know, okay, we're making this. And, I finally have the right tools.
It just, it feels so good. You know, just, like we have the right ingredient to make this happen.It’s wonderful.
Brittany: That’s so wonderful. Emmy, thank you so much for taking the time to talk with me today about your journey with your YouTube channel. This was so great.
Emmy: Thanks, Brittany. Thanks so much for your time.
[22:00]
Brittany: Emmy has it all figured out! She’s achieved the kind of work-life balance some people spend their whole careers chasing. And she does work that she enjoys. I mean, Emmy’s been on YouTube for almost 11 years now! And she has consistently created videos that her fans obviously love.
It’s no wonder she caught the attention of YouTube early on. After our conversation I actually learned that in 2013 Emmy won YouTube’s NextUp competition. Because of that program, she was able to upgrade her gear and meet and learn from other creators.
Today there are even more ways that creators can work with YouTube to maximize their potential. I wanted to learn more about programs like these, so I turned to Jamie Reichstein over at YouTube.
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Brittany: Hi Jamie, it’s so great to be talking with you!
Jaimie: Hi, Brittany. Thanks for having me.
Brittany: To kick things off, why don’t you introduce yourself for our listeners?
Jaimie: Hi, my name's Jamie Reichstein, and I lead creator programs at YouTube. I do everything from figuring out products that our creators should know about to, uh, developing programs and investments around our key community.
[23:00]
Brittany: That’s interesting, what kinds of programs?
Jaimie: You know, YouTube does so much more than offer a platform where you can upload videos. We offer virtual education sessions. We offer the creator hub where you can do on demand learning and testing and evolve as you learn more over time. Wwe provide programs where you can connect with like-minded creators, whether it's gamers, black voices, female creators, whether you're in the beginning of your journey or uh, at the top of your game and you want to teach others.
Brittany: Okay. So you guys have been covering a lot of ground with these programs. Can you talk to me about some of the things that you've been working on lately?
[24:00]
Jaimie: So YouTube has a really wide range of programs and initiatives that are aimed at helping creators build thriving channels, and two of the newest are the YouTube Black Voices fund and shorts fund. So shorts are just what they sound like. They're short, catchy videos. They're created using your mobile phone. And recently, we announced a $100 million shorts fund that will be distributed to shorts creators over the next year.
And every month, thousands of short creators with the most views and engagement will be eligible to receive revenue from this fund. The other fund I wanted to mention was the YouTube Black Voices fund. And this was created in 2020 as a way to lift up, center, and celebrate the diverse range of black voices on our platform.
[25:00]
The goal of all of these programs, one of which is Black Voices Gund, is to promote more, and diverse, authentic, varied perspectives. And really celebrate the voices that are unique and on our platform today. And we at YouTube, through these programs, say we want to help celebrate those and bring you from where you are today to where you want to be tomorrow.
Brittany: So what kind of growth have you seen as a result of these programs?
Jaimie: It's really interesting as I've been an employee of YouTube since 2008. I've seen the evolution of not only YouTube and the creator ecosystem, but our response as a platform and as, as an industry of creative individuals, uh, putting content out there for others to enjoy, I think what's, what I've noticed is that, it's almost cyclical. The beginning of your journey is really exciting.
[26:00]
There's so much opportunity, and we find ways in which we can engage with you and connect you with other creators at that stage in their journey. And as your creator journey evolves throughout the life cycle, we see this growth, and this explosion, and these trends. And people really evolve, and they grow up and they become businesses on the platform with all of the amazing opportunities they provide. But off-platform as well, whether they're developing their own brands for sale or whether they're going on tour and performing, or they're coming to conventions and summits that are put on by us or by other creators to once again, teach and connect the next generation of creators.
Brittany: It sounds like youtube offers a flexibility for content creators that maybe more traditional media spaces didn’t before. Talk to me more about that.
[27:00]
Jaimie: So not to age myself, but when I was growing up, if you wanted to get into an industry, a creative industry, or work in production or produce content, there was a very systematic way in which you would do that.
And it still exists, where you pitch a concept, you write a concept, it's reviewed by executives and it's approved or not. And it wasn't really until YouTube came along, that creators were able to leverage their voice more often, more easily and get an audience.
[music in]
And then from there, YouTube became a platform that enabled these creators to share their voice, but also a partner that said, “Hey, there's more opportunity for you to continue and evolve this as a business. And we want to think of ways in which we can help you do that.”
[28:00]
Brittany: Jamie, it has been so great to learn from you today. Thank you so much for chatting with me.
Jaimie: Thank you for having me, Brittany.
Brittany: It’s programs like the ones Jaimie describes that help self-made creators like Emmy stand out in today’s sea of digital content. In our next and final episode in this season, we will look at how YouTube is helping amplify the work of creators in the music industry. You don’t want to miss it. Thanks for joining me on this journey into the world of YouTube creators. I’ll catch you next time. In the meantime, don’t forget to rate, review and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
[29:00]
The Upload:The Rise of the Creator Economy is a YouTube Podcast produced in partnership with National Public Media. Our Executive Producers are Brianna LaFleur and Erica Osher. Our Supervising Producer is Shannon Boerner. Our Lead Producer is Theresa Avila. Editing and Engineering by Alie Kilts. Production Assistance by Gurjit Kaur with support from Maddy Weinberg. Our logo was created by Jen Grottle and our music is by TIMALIKESMUSIC. I’m your host Brittany Luse, thanks for listening.
[music out]